Continued from Part I of interview...
What has changed most in the scouting work since you started – what is different now – and for better or worse?
The technology now is wonderful – now a game can end and an hour later you can pull up the video on your computer.
What’s lost is the comradery between scouts. It used to be like a fraternity. At the combine we used to have free time to meet up and talk and get drinks together. Now, it’s much more secretive and everyone is more suspicious of each other. Everyone wants to be a GM now – they all have five-year plans to go from scout to GM. I don’t blame them for being ambitious but it’s not very reasonable.
When you’re studying a player, what would surprise fans and maybe even the players on what you may be looking for that we would not think of?
When I am scouting quarterbacks and cornerbacks, I really want to see them live. I want to get a feel for the way they handle pressure and how they respond. If a quarterback throws an interception, are they sitting at the bench by themselves or are they going and getting their teammates pumped up and accepting the blame?
Cornerbacks – you just can’t see them a lot on film. Often times they are away from the play and you can’t see them when the play is on the other side. I want to see what they are doing in those circumstances. Cam Heyward even at his age now chases plays down 60 yards downfield. So if I’m seeing a young cornerback taking the play off because it’s happening on the other side of the field, that’s something I notice. You can be not involved in a play but still make yourself involved.
What’s the biggest trap you can fall into as a scout – where can you go the most wrong?
It’s easy to criticize and tear down a player and fault them and kill them unjustifiably. You need to look for what they can do. What is the one thing they can of better than anyone else – if even for just a few plays a game. There’s no harm in stressing that. You’ll have 40 reports on that guy – your cross-checker, assistant GM, GM, position coach, coordinator – they’ll all have reports on the guy. So if I undergrade the guy and I’m in the room talking about them, there’s no way to push him up in the room. If I gave him a sixth round grade I’ve made it impossible to say we should take him earlier. I’ve made that mistake before.
I recently spoke to Mark Gorscak who talked about his ability to use his travels as a scout to experience new things outside of football. What non-football experiences have you been able to realize due to being a scout?
Some of that I did when I was younger. I knew my schedule – who I was talking to and where and could schedule that.
I got to see every inch of this country as a scout – every state except Alaska, because they don’t play football there. I drove past Mount Rushmore and the Grand Canyon and through the swamps in Louisiana. It’s been amazing, the things I’ve seen – including every major school and tons of the little ones. You can drop me anywhere in the United States and I’ll know how to get home!
Any advice for people looking to get into scouting now? How important is it to have played to be an effective scout?
I’m going through that now with my son who’s at WVU. He wants to be a scout. I tell him it’s a lot of work and time on the road. You have to watch a ton of tape and talk to a lot of people. A lot of late nights and early mornings. You go to practice in the afternoon, get to your hotel at night and write up your reports until 1 am, then do it all over again. It’s a grind and people don’t see that part of it.
I was lucky – I was around the team as a kid due to my dad. That helped me get an internship with the team. We hired one new scout every couple of years from the internship program, and the rest of the interns the team would try and get jobs for around the league. You just have to call everyone and send your resume to everyone you can. You have to be relentless – to show them them what they’d want to see from you as a scout.
What are some of the good scouting stories you can share – some fun stories?
I remember in Maine, there was a little motel I drove up to to stay at. I went to the office and there were four people sitting around there laughing. I got the key – it was for room 12 – the rooms were in another building. So I go there and see room 10, 11, then 13 and 14. So I go back and tell them there’s no room 12, and they tell me it’s on the other side of the building.
So I go and see room 12 and walk in. It’s this little room and there’s just this partition separating the room from the bathroom. On the other side there’s this old TV – one with the knobs you had to turn and had to pull to turn it on – no remote. Well, I write my reports and turn the TV off. At 3 am I wake up to the TV – it’s on. I figured somebody had to be in the room. I was creeping along the floor towards the partition to see if anyone was on the other side hiding behind the wall – but no one was there.
I figured it must have been a room where they go play jokes on people. It was really strange. I told the guys at the motel about it when I left and they just laughed. I think they went and played me for a fool!
Any good stories on players you scouted?
I fought for Tony Siragusa when I was working for Indianapolis. I had a starter grade on him but he went undrafted due to his knee problems and the fact he was overweight. I went to my boss and told him we should sign him, but he told me he didn’t want him because of his knee issues. Gus Sunseri was Tony’s agent, so I told Gus and Gus said he’d sign a waiver on the knee. I went back to my boss and he still said “No! He’s too fat and lazy,” he said. I knew he played hard though – it wasn’t always pretty but he played hard. I went back to Gus and told him my boss said no, so Gus told me he’d play for no singing bonus and the minimum salary. I went back and forth six times between my boss and Gus and Tony. Finally my boss said fine – but it was on my head. That if he got hurt and was out on IR it was on me.
Well, Tony did everything in camp – he even long-snapped and ended up making the team. The first practice after the last cuts my boss walked up to Tony and told him he made him look good signing him. Tony told him “You didn’t want me!” He knew my boss didn’t want to sign him – he was in the room with Gus when I went back and forth with them. He ended up having a great career. He really loved life.
You mentioned your time with the Steelers as a kid – any last fun story there?
I was a ballboy for those ’70s teams. A Hall of Fame player – I won’t say who as he’s still with us – used to pay me to sleep in his bed while he snuck out at night. The bed check guys would come into every room to check on the players, and they’d see my legs sticking out from the bed!
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