First, let me know what you’ve been doing since your time in the NFL!
Well after ball I went into the construction business with my brother. Then we decided to build a roller-skating rink and I ran that for a while. I did some development in Texas then just jumped around a bit so no one could catch up with me!
Was the transition from the NFL to post-NFL life tough for you?
You miss the fun you have playing. And most of all you miss your teammates. It seems wherever I went – the Giants, Steelers – I met some great people. That’s what you miss more than anything else.
How did you end up in Pittsburgh after being drafted by the Giants and playing for them?
Well, the Steelers picked me up off of waivers. I had a bad knee and Coach Austin said he would bring me in and nurture my knee and get me back to health. It worked out great.
Of course they had that great draft and brought in Greene, Greenwood, Bradshaw, Dwight White and all those other guys. It was a great defense to work with and a great nucleus. And most of all they were real good people.
Did anyone help mentor you when you got there – show you the ropes?
They kind of left it up to you then to figure out where you fit in. LaVern Torgerson was the defensive coordinator at the time. I played the middle and outside – two-to-three spots on the defense – and lined up on the tight end side. Russell was on the weak side and May was in the middle usually. It worked good. Of course back then you did what the coaches asked you to do. You didn’t get to pick and choose like guys get to do today!
Any fun memories of your time there?
In New York I remember Y.A. Tittle running down for a touchdown then he started naming off 49’ers plays and no one knew what he was talking about! Turns out he was hit in the noggin and didn’t know where he was!
I also remember when I was playing in the middle I’d hear Joe Greene talking to the guard when he was lined up over them at tackle. He’d tell them he knew where they were going and he was going to beat them there. He would keep talking to the linemen during the game and I think it probably had an effect on the players psychologically. I think it did get to some of their heads.
Any more on Joe?
Once I remember Fran Tarkenton was scrambling and Joe was chasing him all over the field – from the right side to the left side. Tarkenton finally ran out of bounds and Joe kept coming and hit him. Tarkenton asked what the heck he was doing and Joe told him that he was chasing him all over the damn field – he wasn’t going without hitting him!
There was also a big fight in New Orleans. I was playing outside linebacker then and they drove to our one or two yard line. Greene shot offsides and knocked the guard down. They called the next play and Greene just did it again. That’s when it all started. I don’t think they ever got to Joe though! He was one of the toughest and quickest defensive tackles I’ve ever seen.
Speaking of fights. Ray Mansfield told me this story that happened after I left. They were playing Chicago and Butkus was on the sidelines when Greene came over and hit a guy out of bounds. Butkus got up and came over but Greene shot him a look and spit. Mansfield said he thought it was going to be the biggest fight the NFL had ever seen! But nothing happened though – Butkus walked away and that was that.
You were there when Noll came on board….
Noll was set in his ways. He has his way of running a defense. And he had Bradshaw who would throw into the defense but threw so hard he’d complete the pass anyway.
Any thoughts on the game today – you watch the NFL still?
I’m a Steelers fan still. I have been ever since I met the Rooneys – they are such good people – it’s such a good family organization. I have twin grandsons now – my son played at Iowa. On Sundays we watch games. He’s a big Detroit fan so we get to hassle each other a bit.
I still enjoy watching the game. And I’m still in contact with some of the guys on occasion – like Andy Russell. But there’s not many of us left anymore!
Read more by former Steelers via the book Steelers Takeaways: Player Memories Through the Decades. To order, just click on the book:
