First, let me know what you’re doing with yourself now?
I’m living in Arizona now- living the dream. I can’t ask for no more than this. I’ll be 52 this year – and right now I’m sitting in my garage, drinking Miller Lite and smoking my cigar. Sometimes I watch my neighbors kids – block off the street and let them play ball. And now I’m just looking forward to football season starting up again.
Was the post-NFL adjustment tough for you?
It was easier for me than it was for most guys. The reason is I listened to the guy that represented me. I wasn’t hard-headed – I listened to his advice and stayed financially sound. I wish more guys would have taken his advice. It was mostly about making paper – I had no complaints with him. He kept me responsible. I’m one person. Why do I need five damn cars right?
So looking back on it, what brought you to Pittsburgh from Cleveland?
I didn’t get along with Bill Belichick. He and I didn’t see eye to eye. He didn’t understand how I lived my life. I was productive and put up my numbers. I went out and partied, but I still played better than most of the guys that didn’t party and sucked.
He didn’t like my lifestyle. I was never late. Never overweight. I did my job.
How did he know about your partying? And what happened there?
Every coach has his snitches. You know that! Every team has one.
One night I got into a fight at a bar with Gerald Dixon. He called me a bitch and I told him if he did it again I’d hit him. He said it again and my fist was in his mouth before he finished the word. A week after that I was cut.
How did you end up in Pittsburgh?
I needed a job. Cincinnati and the Giants wanted to sign me too, but I played for John Mitchell in Cleveland and wanted to play for him in Pittsburgh. I preferred to play for him – he was tough but understanding.
After Steed got suspended for PEDs, they needed a defensive tackle who could play all the positions.
Did the Pittsburgh guys give you any grief as a former rival player? Anyone help you get acclimated to the team?
Nah they welcomed me with open arms. No one needed to take me under their wing – I didn’t need it.
Cowher helped me the most though – he just told me to be myself. That’s all I could be.
Any good memories of your time there in Pittsburgh?
I remember going to the Clark Bar and meeting Dusty Baker for the first time. And winning the AFC North. We were a family in Pittsburgh. We played hard and worked hard and won.
I hung out with Buckner, Bell, Flowers, Figures – we all had each other’s back. Jim Miller and Myron Bell – we went to Michigan State so of course we hung out a lot. And you always hang out with your position guys. That was my circle.
The best thing about playing for the Steelers was that they were winners. We all went to the same spots after road games to hang out. We lost and won together as a team. Even when we lost the Super Bowl, we lost like champions. I remember Cowher telling us “Let’s give it a shot again next year” in the locker room.
Did the Browns guys give you problems – playing them twice a year?
When we played Cleveland in Cleveland, I went back and pissed on their locker room floor. Seriously. I didn’t care if they saw me. I never lost to Cleveland after I left. I never trash-talked them though. I never wanted to waste that energy and give other teams bulletin board material.
But I did get some “Atta boys” from the Browns players. They told me Cleveland fucked up letting me go.
You mentioned before that Cowher helped you – how so?
Cowher – I won’t say he was the best coach ever in the history of the NFL or anything, but the shit I was going through – he was the guy that I needed in my life.
I was cheating on my wife – he told me I needed to be more discreet. I’d come to practice hung over, but he just told me that as long as I did my job I had nothing to worry about. That was the blueprint for keeping me going forward.
Belichick – that mother – he couldn’t ever look you in the eye and have a conversation. He is a great coach – I can’t deny that. But if a person can’t look you in the eye and talk to you – well, I never could trust him. I know he is the most successful coach – maybe ever. If I had a kid that played for him I’d tell him to listen to him and he could learn a lot. I just didn’t like him as a person – and he could say the same thing about me. I couldn’t give a fuck.
Any good memories from that Super Bowl?
I was still young and dumb. If I had it do to over again, I would have prepared differently. But if my auntie had balls, she’d be my uncle. Can’t do anything about it.
We brushed off losses in Pittsburgh well. No one was a backup there either. You were just a second starter. You had to be ready because nothing changed for nobody – not the offense, not the defense – not special teams. I think it was because their coaches were ex-players. They knew how to prepare us.
What happened after those two seasons in Pittsburgh?
Pittsburgh had cut me. At that point they didn’t want troublemakers and I was one. Off the field I got in trouble – I got a DUI. They didn’t want any of that.
I signed with the Rams after Pittsburgh. I was the bottom guy in camp – but I beat out every lineman to become the starter for all 16 gams that season for them.
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