First, can you tell me what you’ve been up to since playing football?
I’m just trying to survive – to stay alive! I see a lot of guys my age dropping – guys in their 50’s. It’s scary. I’m exercising more, riding my bike and eating better. I think I’m in decent shape now but it’s personal. I lost two bothers in 2020 – one to a massive heart attack and one to complications with diabetes. That has taken its toll on me.
Other than that I’m just hanging out – nothing special. Just traveling and seeing family. Appreciating living.
Was the post-NFL transition difficult?
That adrenaline rush from playing football had to be replaced. I got into row racing for a while – motorcycle racing. That helped replace that adrenaline for a while. It was a dumb thing to do but I didn’t do anything major. I had kids lapping me! But I did it because I had taken up riding motorcycles and to help me, I took the row racing classes – that helped me to take turns better.
Looking over your career – who helped mentor you most when you started and how?
I’d be remiss if I didn’t say Ronnie Lott, Eric Wright and Keena Turner. Ray Rhodes too. They helped show me the right mentality to play. You can have all the right skills but if you don’t know how to compete you aren’t as going to be as good. You have to know how to compete – how to have that beast inside of you. I was born with it – my mother said I was a peculiar child – I hated to lose! Those guys showed me how to play with that mentality.
What brought you to the Steelers in ’94 – why sign with them?
I was 29 years old. I had just been with the Falcons and won two Super Bowl rings – but I got no free agent offers. Finally, Detroit signed me in ’93 – in July. I played there and became a free agent again after that – and at the last minute my agent called and told me the Steelers wanted to bring me in. Someone got hurt and they brought me in.
Yancey Thigpen – I hung out with him when I got there. Lloyd and Figures too.
It was awesome – they treated me nice. I was off by a good margin on my incentives but they gave my my bonus anyway. Mr. Rooney thanked me and told me I did a great job and helped them.
Why did you leave the next season?
After that season I was one of 10 players that they didn’t protect in the supplemental draft – I was a 10 year veteran so that made sense. But Dom Capers scooped me up in Carolina – he knew me and what I could do. He knew my skills and that my game travelled. It didn’t matter what the scheme or system was – I always delivered. It was always financial why I left a team – it was never about my play. I never got that big contract – but I got 12 of them though!
Imagine a guy like me – watching guys wish they did what I did – and seeing them make the Hall of Fame. I had 33 picks and two Super Bowl Rings – Revis had 29 picks. But he had Revis Island. Ronde Barber was never as accomplished as I was either.
What made you a good slot corner?
Confidence and technique – and patience. That’s what it takes to play in the slot and as left corner. We played a system in Pittsburgh where we played off the Z receiver at the line of scrimmage. That made it much harder to get our hands on them – it gave them more wiggle room to juke around us. You had to have patience as a corner in that system. Nowadays defensive backs are too reliant on the pass rush and don’t learn enough technique.
How so?
The coaches would tell the cornerbacks in Pittsburgh to watch me play. I was a technician – I worked a lot on my footwork. I came out of my backpedal faster that most corners. That was key. So I could stay with receivers better. I went out and got my picks – they were just bad throws – I diagnosed and reacted and had quick feet to make plays on passes.
You have to trust your feet. You can’t open up your gait and run with receivers like it’s the Kentucky Derby. You have to try and get your hands on them – you can’t all the time of course. But you can’t let them run free. The right cornerback has an advantage because the X receiver plays on the line of scrimmage so you can get your hands on them easier. The left and slot corners – that’s tougher.
How difficult was the Steelers defense to adapt to?
The defense was easy! They just called everything differently. But cover 2 is cover 2 and cover 3 is cover 3. We did a lot of fire zone – Woodson blitzed his ass off. The whole defense led the league in sacks that season – that’s when it became the Blitzburgh Defense.
That loss to San Diego – a lot of people pointed to the Martin touchdown as the reason we lost. But Pupunu was wide open on his touchdown – that was a blown assignment. I let Martin get behind me and that’s on me. But we had the ball on the four yard line, first and goal and didn’t score. We can pick a play but a bunch of plays lost that game.
Cowher pointed that out to me. He told me not to blame myself – that we had the opportunity to win the game and that there were at least seven other plays that he could name that helped lose that game too.
You seemed to take that play so exceptionally hard at the time – why was that?
I’m the one who is supposed to make the plays – not give them up.
It’s funny because Greg Lloyd hit Humphries right as he threw it and the ball just floated towards the goalpost. Martin – he juked me real good. But if the ball was thrown where it was supposed to go – to the sideline – I think I could have made a play on it. He had three-to-five steps on me when it was thrown but I hauled ass and almost was able to knock it out of his hands – I swiped at it over his head. I didn’t give up on it.
It sounds like you think you weren’t appreciated enough over the NFL?
Capers knew me and gave me a chance to start in ’95 and I had the longest pick-six in Carolina history – against my old team San Francisco. My goodness that felt good!
My first Super Bowl I led the team in interceptions – did you know that? That year people never recognized my skills like I thought they should. Madden put me on his All-Madden team! But the beat writers didn’t recognize me. I won two Super Bowl rings, had more interceptions and more years of service than Revis. I was a better cornerback than Revis, but he had better hype. He had Revis Island and was a first round pick. I was just a third-round pick from Texas-Arlington.
Any memories stand out of your time in Pittsburgh?
That was a good time – some good dudes there. Dawson, Bam Morris – those were good guys. Playing dominos in the locker room. I wore them out – I beat Kirkland, Lake, Perry, Woodson – all those guys!
And I got a lot of fan mail after the San Diego game from fans consoling me. It was a great experience.
I used to joke around with the guys in the locker room. I was the only one I think with a Super Bowl ring. They looked up to me because of that. I would pick on them sometimes and tell them that until they got a ring, they needed to just sit down! Some of the guys told me they would have had one if I didn’t get burnt against San Diego! But I just asked them who was covering Pupunu! At least I was close to my guy!
Lastly, any thoughts on the way the NFL has changed since you played?
You can’t hit no one ferociously anymore! The way they protect quarterbacks is ridiculous – you might as well just put red jerseys on them. Guys are faster and stronger – linemen are running like tight ends now. And it’s so pass happy – they don’t appreciate running backs any more. They are almost obsolete. If you can’t catch as a running back you better rush for 2,000 yards!
It’s still a good game though. They are making life-changing money now.
I thank Pittsburgh to this day for the opportunity to play there. They were fair and nice to me. They gave me an opportunity to play and they were great people. I think you can put a bow on it with that!
Read more by former Steelers via the book Steelers Takeaways: Player Memories Through the Decades. To order, just click on the book:
