First, can you let us know what you’ve been up to since your playing days?
A little of this and a little of that. I and a partner opened upon some restaurants – in Raleigh-Durham and Baltimore. I’m also daddy-Uber – talkng my daughter to practices and school. I’m enjoying taking her to school and spending time with her while she’s still here.
How hard has the post-NFL adjustment been for you?
It was tough – it’s what you’ve been doing most of your life as a player – since I was eight years old. Then you get into your early 30’s and all of the sudden you can’t do it anymore – it’s taken away from you. Some have the chance to retire when they want and plan for their retirement but I had to retire abruptly. It was different – I didn’t get the chance to plan for it. So it was a tough adjustment.
But – its ok not to be ok. Some struggle with it because their identity was as a player for so long. You have to re-create yourself and that’s a challenge, trying to find what you want to be next.
I’m a foodie – so when my partner got me involved in the restaurant in North Carolina I was happy. I wasn’t sure, but lo and behold, it turned out good. We’re still partners today – my business partner and I are like family. I knew him for years – we know each other’s kids and he was in the restaurant business for years so I got a chance to learn from him. We’ve been open since 2012 and are doing well. We made it through Covid and actually opened up two new restaurants during Covid. Its been exciting to hire and help young people learn the business.
Were you surprised to be drafted by the Ravens – any mentors when you first got there?
I had no idea who would draft me. I am still close to a lot of those guys today.
Guys who helped me included Tony Siragusa, God rest his soul. And Ray Lewis – I watched him and learned from him.
Rex Ryan was my position coach and his personality was great. Burnett, McCrary – those two took me under their wing and showed me that I could do this. I was like a sponge around them. They had a lot of veterans there who played in so many different systems: they gave me information from their different experiences. They were one of the best defenses to ever play – letting up only 165 points. One of the best in history.
Bennie Thompson was also a guy that helped me on special teams. He poured that into me. He told me that with so many veterans on that great defense, I’d have to play special teams to contribute at first. He taught me how to read the different schemes and told me I should be insulted if they didn’t double team me when I was a gunner. I didn’t get it – I told him I didn’t want to be double-teamed! But he told me it was the ultimate respect from other team’s coaches if they felt they couldn’t block me with just one guy. He helped me to understand that. I ended up making the Pro Bowl as a special teams player in 2003.
You were so versatile – played a number of different positions including inside linebacker, outside linebacker, nose tackle, defensive end, safety and even cornerback. Was that something you really enjoyed or did it get frustrating at times?
I embraced it. It gives you so much flexibility on defense. It’s so hard for the offense to identify what you are doing – and the more you can do personally the more valuable you are. I was like a utility knife – it made the defense more fun because we were all given a chance – we all had our number called at times. Certain teams had good tight ends – when we played Dallas Clark I couldn’t blitz – I covered him. But with another team that didn’t have a good tight end I could blitz. Then with another team, maybe they had a good tight end, but they’d change it up and have someone else cover him and I would blitz. They’d look for 96 and get hit by a blitz from the other side. They’d be looking for 96 – they’d see me playing nose tackle and wonder what I was doing there now.
It kept people guessing – I embraced it. It made me a better player as well – I had to learn every position – it started to all overlap and the game really slowed down for me. When you experience that, its like you know the play before it happens. It’s a cool place to be.
How aware were you of that Steelers-Ravens rivalry when you got to the NFL?
I recall Rex Ryan – this was when I wasn’t aware – but I remember him telling the defensive line that it was Steelers week – to eat a lot of meat and potatoes. The Steelers had two big backs, big tight ends, Plaxico and Ward…It was two yards and a cloud of dust. They ran that power run – pulled the offensive line. That’s who they were. We knew what they were going to do and they knew what we were going to do. Nothing mattered except it was mano y mano. We beat them that first game 16-0 and I saw that rivalry in action.
The rivalry went back and forth – we beat them and they beat us. We didn’t like them and they didn’t like us. Ward was out there with his cheap shots that they later outlawed… I loved the rivalry week with the physicality of the two teams.
What are your best memories of the rivalry?
I remember when Ben came in and Bart Scott almost killed him with that big hit. I remember intercepting him as well. We had a Steeler Package in Baltimore where I played safety. Hines used to crack block on our safeties so they put me in that spot. I pointed that out to him – I told him to crack me. He could never do it when someone was looking at him – it was kind of cowardly. He still tried to get me once when I wasn’t looking but he hit me and ended up decleating himself. He was a tough receiver and a good competitor – I know the Pittsburgh world liked him, but others didn’t. But he was a good competitor.
It never mattered each team’s record when we played each other – their team or ours. Even if one was having a bad year it didn’t matter. We knew each other so well – it was just a matter of whether our guy’s will will outlast the other guy’s will. Will was more important than talent – it was about who had the bigger will to dominate.
You had some big games versus Pittsburgh – what made those possible?
We just knew them so well – I could play so many different positions. I’d play safety and they’d wonder what I was doing there, That threw them off – that was our Steeler Package. I’d be in sub-packages playing nosetackle, then regular linebacker. Where was 96? That threw them off – it said a lot about our gameplan.
Ben also held the ball a lot – “He took it like a man,” we’d say. He was as big as their linebackers. I think that’s why we had success. And we knew their tendencies – they gave a lot away. Their formations told us a lot about what they were running. They had some window-dressing with motion, but it didn’t change much.
Who were some of the guys you remember matching up best against?
Starks, Tuman…and chasing Kordell – he was so athletic. They went from Kordell, to Maddox to Ben. The matchups were always good.
And Randle El on special teams. I was a gunner and he was the first returner I played against on special teams. We never showed me a lot as gunner on special teams in preseason. So when he saw me coming that first time and fair caught it, he turned to me and said “What are you doing here dude?”
Was it hard leaving for New England in free agency and what was the biggest difference between the teams?
I didn’t have a contract – it wasn’t just about money. I wanted a chance to go somewhere and win and get financial security. It was tough to leave Baltimore – that was my first love. I think it would have been easier to start off at New England and go somewhere else then vice versa due to the culture of New England. It was just different there.
Both were great organizations – Bill was just so great at situational football. He was very astute with that. No team prepared better than New England in situation football – we practiced it every day in camp.
How did the two teams handle the Steelers games differently?
In New England of course we didn’t play Pittsburgh twice a year. And Pittsburgh was much more chatty – they gave us more billboard material. I remember when their defensive back – Anthony Smith – we took turns scoring on him after he mouthed off. Jabar Gaffney asked him if he knew who he was now after he scored on Smith. We put him on blast – when you say something that’s sideways, Bill used that. Bill always told us to let your play do the talking. Do your talking on Sundays – that’s putting the team first.
Any thoughts on the rivalry today?
It’s interesting to see the rivalry – the old style of play has changed. It’s not as downhill as it used to be. Both teams are trying to figure out their identities a bit. It usually comes down to who turns the ball over the least.