First, let me know what you’ve been doing with yourself since your time in the NFL?
Well, I’ve had a lot of issues with concussions and head injuries. I’m retired – living here in Cincinnati.
First, any fun memories of the Steelers-Bengals rivalry?
The best story I have is that Mike Webster and I were both University of Wisconsin guys. So there was that rivalry between us – two Badgers going at it.
We knew each other and were both so competitive. Mike was a man’s center. Some centers were finesse guys and some were physical guys. Mike was a physical guy. We used to scout each other during the games we played against each other. We’d give each other pluses or minuses on every play. He’d tell me he got me on the play, but I’d tell him they still didn’t get any yards, so we’d argue over pluses and minuses every play.
It was great going against guys like that.
And you played for Coach LeBeau – how was he to play for?
He was a genius at schemes and taking advantage of another team’s weaknesses and avoiding their strengths. He knew who we should avoid and knew who to go after – he knew how to look at personnel and see that. He knew the reality of how you beat teams that way.
LeBeau was like a dad – if you needed a dad he’d be it. He had a pro’s approach to the game. He was very stern and to the point but he cared about you. He’d tell you – if you don’t know – ask.
I still send him cards for his birthday every year, and he is known for sending handwritten, sincere cards back. And I’ll always remember him reciting the Night Before Christmas word for word before Christmas. I was amazed at how he could remember all of it.
He never liked screens either – phones, TVs. computers… He’d give us handouts and I loved that. He’d show you how to do things. He was a teacher.
Any examples?
I was a two-gap guy – not many guys play that way any more. He’d show me how to deal with double-teams – not to let them get underneath me. The Steelers liked to double-team me a lot and he showed me how to rip through blocks and slide between blockers and double-teams.
And when we played Pittsburgh, win or lose, we wanted to make sure they knew we came to play when they walked off the field after the game.
You were one of the more intense players on those Bengals teams right?
Well, let’s out it this way. When I was a rookie they drafted Dave Remington early – I was a later pick. Forrest Gregg used to run the Oklahoma Drills – they don’t allow those any more. But who did he put me up against? That’s right – Dave Remington. And who do you think won that matchup? Yep – I did. I went a little bit past the whistle and Remington was upset about it.
After Gregg walked up to me and told me I just made the team and to keep up the good work. I asked him if I could still fight every day and do the drills. He said “Absolutely!”
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