First, can you let mw know what you’ve been up to since you retired from football?
I’m the Director of the K Club at Kansas State University Athletics – where I went to school. K Club is for all alumni across all Kansas State athletics that ever donned a K-State logo.
My job is to keep them engaged with the athletic department – reunions, connecting with old teammates and friends and to keep them engaged with current student athletes. We want to make it a great experience for current players and alumni.
What have you noticed is a difference between the older and current athletes when you see all of you together? What is that engagement like?
The game has changed honestly – that’s the biggest thing. The style – it was more physical before. It’s fun to see them all together now and talk about those differences and similarities. They all did some form of athletics and it brings them all together. Just seeing them hanging out together and sharing stories and being together is nice.
Any of those guys stand out to you – ones you really enjoy speaking with?
Quintin Neujahr is a guy I enjoy talking to. He had a unique experience – he was there in the 80’s. There was an article that came out then that called Kansas State “Futility U.” because the school was the first Division 1 school to hit 500 losses. It asked if the program was worth saving. Then Coach Snyder came in and turned the program around Quentin was a part of that turnaround – and he played center like I did. So it is fun talking to him about Coach Snyder and what they went through.
Stepping back – can you talk about the decision to sign with Pittsburgh as an undrafted free agent. Why Pittsburgh?
My agent was Vann McElroy – he was a former Raider who played in the 80’s. He had a good sense of Mike Munchak as a player and as a person. He thought he’d be a good fit for me – his style of coaching and who he was would be good for me.
I also was a big Steelers fan – I used to watch them with my dad growing up.
So Vann told me he’d call Pittsburgh and start there before calling other teams and said he’d try and negotiate with Pittsburgh. Well a few minutes later he called me back and told me “Congratulations, you’re a Steeler!” He said Pittsburgh didn’t even negotiate – they just accepted the offer.
Who helped you most when you first got there – and how?
Mike Munchak extended my career – he and all the guys there really. I was fortunate – they had the same guys there at the core of the offensive line for seven years – that’s extremely rare. They didn’t even have to make calls at that point – they understood the plays so well and knew how each other played. They were all on the same page.
Mike was a Hall of Fame player and I hope a Hall of Fame coach too someday. His style was that he was thorough with everything. He’d go through the playbook drawing-by-drawing and made guys ask questions. He was always available – at any time. During the week or on game days. There were no dumb questions. Sometimes you’d ask a question and when he answered you were like “I should have known that!” but he’d just have a good laugh at that.
Did anyone take you under their wing – on and off the field?
Everyone played a role – Ramon and Pounce (Pouncey} – they helped me quite a bit. We all had our unique way of doing things – all of our body types were different. The big knock on me was that I had short arms and Ramon had really long arms. But we were shown how to find our own unique ways to accomplish what Coach Munchak was asking for.
Was that a normal approach – giving players that kind of freedom to find their own way like that?
That wasn’t normal, no. It wasn’t like that in the other places I played. Coach Munchak had his own way but understood it wasn’t cookie-cutter. He was always learning. He said you either keep learning or die. The final result is what mattered to him – but he wanted to help you find your own way that was best for you to execute on it. He would tell us what he wanted done and then worked with us to find the best way to get it done.
As you got some years under your belt, you became the mentor instead of mentee. How did you enjoy takin on that role as a mentor?
It was surreal, sort of. It all comes full circle, doing the same thing for the younger guys that guys did for me. You feel a sort of sense of pride. I’d be lying if I said it wasn’t in my mind that we were sometimes mentoring guys who could be your replacement, but there is so much pride in the offensive line room to be the best unit in the league. You shelve your personal pride to help the unit and team succeed. We all realized that you’re just one play away from being done. You have to be in tune for the offense to succeed so we had to be sure the next guy was ready.
Was it difficult leaving Pittsburgh in free agency?
Yes. It was hard, no question. My wife and I built some great relationships in Pittsburgh. We had a routine and loved the city and the people. It hurt that the team didn’t want to match the offer from Seattle because of the relationship I thought I had with the front office and coaches.
I had a coach tell me that it was a business. That if Pittsburgh didn’t match the offer I should go take the money because that money only comes once. I had to take care of my family. So when Pittsburgh didn’t match, ultimately I had to take the offer from Seattle.
You returned in 2021 – what was the difference between the team you left and the team you returned to?
It was much younger. I went from being the youngest on offensive line to the oldest – and I was just one year removed from the team.
Do you think fans understand how hard it is to gel – that it’s more than just five talented guys?
I think the position is undervalued and misunderstood. There are so many moving parts to a play. I know coach coaches may look at a play and say what is wrong. But getting five guys to gel takes time – to truly become a tight-knit group. It goes beyond a season – and it’s not just on the field. It’s across all phases of life. Offensive linemen are unusually tight-knit units – the closest unit on a team. We hung out together and got to know each other and that really helped.
My favorite stories come from our Thursday night offensive line dinners. They were usually at Pounce’s house or sometimes Marcus Gilbert’s house. Getting together and spending two hours every week together – those were great times. Those dinners gained a reputation around the league – the guys in Seattle talked about them.
What made them so well-known?
I’m not sure really. Other teams just talked about them because I think they knew how close we were. We’d have food catered and hung out.
Do you think the current team is doing this?
I’m not sure if it’s happening now. I hope so. But that was a big part of our success for us – we all loved and enjoyed it and we learned a lot about each other. We made the effort to make it happen.
Any good stories you can share of your time there?
A couple good ones from the film room.
Certain plays the coaches would circle – Munchak, Garrett or Klemm would want to talk more about. One day we were watching post-game film of our game versus Kansas City. It was a screen play and I did my job on the defensive lineman steering them away from the play. Then I ran downfield and cut the legs of the next defender, then rolled so I could jump up faster to get to the next block. Well, they were all laughing watching me do this on film. It just looked off how I did it. I could have done that 1,000 times and it wouldn’t have looked like that one play. it was just funny seeing it on film and how I was rolling around and getting to the pile.
Another time we were watching film on Buffalo. We were going through the tape and on the tape you always had the screen showing the time, down and distance so you understood the situation. Well, above the screen was a fan with no shirt. It was snowing – you could just tell they were freezing. Well one of the linemen points that out and Munchak just responded: “Oh yeah. I’m trying to show you this blitz on film and you see the guy with no shirt on instead!”
We had so much fun together – it was truly a social and unique time.
When you look at the team now and how the line is working on getting that same unity you had – what advice would you give them?
That’s hard. I’d say control the things you can control and go about putting in the work – make sure no one outworks the offensive line unit – on or off the field.
Its the little things that may seem insignificant – that off-the-field stuff included – but those things translate to success. I tried to share that with the guys when I came back. That hanging out off the field is important. I tried to help make that take hold there. If you’re not together as a unit it makes the season longer – it weighs on your mind more. Especially if things aren’t going well at first, having those guys be five-to-seven of your best friends that you want to go to battle with together every week – that makes it easier to get it turned around mentally.
Read more by former Steelers via the book Steelers Takeaways: Player Memories Through the Decades. To order, just click on the book:
